{"id":16159,"date":"2008-08-25T20:18:00","date_gmt":"2008-08-26T01:18:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/?p=16159"},"modified":"2019-11-28T20:25:08","modified_gmt":"2019-11-29T02:25:08","slug":"does-the-whole-church-refer-only-to-the-men","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/does-the-whole-church-refer-only-to-the-men\/","title":{"rendered":"Does &#8220;the whole church&#8221; refer only to the men?"},"content":{"rendered":"\n\t<h2>Question:<\/h2>\n<p>I am so appreciative of all the information from your studies of God\u2019s word that you make available on your web site. I have recently been studying, teaching and preaching on the subject of the Christian woman\u2019s role and her silence or quietness. The information on your web site has been <strong>so helpful<\/strong>!<\/p>\n<p>I have a question which I don\u2019t see covered on the web site (that doesn\u2019t mean it\u2019s not there, just that I don\u2019t <b>see <\/b>it). In Acts 15 the apostles and elders are said to be considering this matter of circumcision and law-keeping for salvation. However, the <em>whole church<\/em>\u00a0is assembled and it is hard for me to follow the progression of apostle-elder talks vs. whole congregation assembly. It is apparent that in v. 12 they are all assembled for the speeches of Barnabas and Paul and v. 13 indicates the whole congregation is assembled for James\u2019 speech.<\/p>\n<p>My question is about v. 22:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church,<\/em><em>\u00a0to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas,<\/em><em>namely, Judas who was also named Barsabas,\u00a0<\/em><em>and Silas, leading men among the brethren.<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>This decision to send men to Antioch is said to have the approval of the\u00a0<em>whole church<\/em>.<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>Does this term ever apply to\u00a0<em>only<\/em>\u00a0the\u00a0<em>men<\/em>\u00a0of the congregation?<\/li>\n<li>If not, do we not infer from this that the women of the congregation had some means of expressing their approval?<\/li>\n<li>How would they do this and not violate the command to \u201c<em>keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak<\/em>\u201d (I Corinthians 14:34)?<\/li>\n<li>Could this indicate that their \u201csilence\u201d is not absolute but means something else (cf. the prophet who has something revealed to a neighboring prophet in I Corinthians 14:30. Does this mean that he cannot utter a sound or is his \u201csilence\u201d just\u00a0<em>not<\/em>\u00a0prophesying?)<\/li>\n<li>Might these women of the Jerusalem congregation have whispered their approval of this idea to their husbands without violating the command to be silent and to be in subjection?<\/li>\n<li>Does \u201csilent\u201d mean absolute silence (i.e., no sound whatsoever)?<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n<p>I know you have probably already had this question posed to you and you may have even covered it in the material on the web site and I just missed it. I would appreciate any thoughts you have from the Bible.<\/p>\n\t<h2>Answer:<\/h2>\n<p>When the last indexing said there are over 5,200 pages of information on the site, I&#8217;m not surprised you (or I for that matter) have trouble finding just the item of information you&#8217;re looking for. I addressed the topic of Acts 15 a few times, but probably the one you will find most useful is the one titled &#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/business-meetings\/\">Business Meetings<\/a>.&#8221;<\/p>\n<p>The phrase &#8220;whole church&#8221; is used several times in the New Testament<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>In the selection of deacons in Acts 6:1-6<\/li>\n<li>In the sending out of Paul and Barnabas in Acts 13:1-3<\/li>\n<li>In hearing and taking the recommended action against Judaizing teachers in Acts 15:4, 22, 30<\/li>\n<li>In withdrawing from the man who was sinning in I Corinthians 5:4-5<\/li>\n<li>In partaking of the Lord&#8217;s Supper in I Corinthians 11:17-20, 34<\/li>\n<li>In worship in I Corinthians 14:23, 26<\/li>\n<li>In selecting men to carry monetary gifts to brethren in Judea in I Corinthians 16:3 and II Corinthians 8:18-19<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>&#8220;Silence&#8221; (or &#8220;quietness&#8221;) in I Timothy 2:11-12 does not mean complete and absolute silence. It refers to acting is a quiet or submissive manner. &#8220;Silence&#8221; in I Corinthians 14:34 does mean not to speak, but it does not mean &#8220;no sound&#8221; about everything, else women could not fulfill the command to sing (Ephesians 5:19; Colossians 3:16). The use of the same word in regards to the prophets (I Corinthians 14:30) tells us that it does not imply silence at all times.<\/p>\n<p>When we read, &#8220;<em>In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus<\/em>&#8221; (I Corinthians 5:4-5), it is not necessary to conclude that only the men withdrew from this sinner. Actually, the implication is the opposite &#8212; the whole church, men and women, withdrew from the sinner.<\/p>\n<p>But I Corinthians 14:23 is probably the clearest since the setting is the gathering of the whole church and Paul has to give regulations when women are not permitted to speak.<\/p>\n<p>I can&#8217;t see how these passages can be read and not conclude that the women of the congregation were present and that they somehow indicated their agreement with decisions reached. We do not find them addressing the congregation or presenting arguments for consideration. But when a proposal is made we do find the whole church acting as one to carry out the decisions which were agreeable to everyone. To argue that &#8220;whole church&#8221; referred only to the men would be arguing that the church is only composed of men, which contradicts, &#8220;<em>There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus<\/em>&#8221; (Galatians 3:28).<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Question: I am so appreciative of all the information from your studies of God\u2019s word that you make available on your web site. I have recently been studying, teaching and preaching on the subject of the Christian woman\u2019s role and her silence or quietness. The information on your web site has been so helpful! I&hellip;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"advanced_seo_description":"","jetpack_seo_html_title":"","jetpack_seo_noindex":false,"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[20],"tags":[448,487,667,82],"class_list":["post-16159","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-answer","tag-church","tag-men","tag-organization-of-the-church","tag-womens-roles"],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_likes_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":84199,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/do-men-hold-a-monopoly-on-the-business-meeting\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":0},"title":"Do Men Hold a Monopoly on the Business Meeting?","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"February 7, 2025","format":false,"excerpt":"by Dale Smelser via Sentry Magazine, Vol. 13, No. 4, December 21, 1987 Several articles by me recently on elders, deacons, and business meetings have led to numerous questions about women attending business meetings. I have noted that the business meeting does not have oversight. We cannot substitute another system\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Article&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Article","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/article\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":16016,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/how-refreshing-to-see-a-church-more-interested-in-promoting-the-bible-than-social-activities\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":1},"title":"How refreshing to see a church more interested in promoting the Bible than social activities","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"August 8, 2008","format":false,"excerpt":"Question: I was searching for VBS materials on-line and typed in \u201cfishers of men\u201d on my search.\u00a0 Your web site came up.\u00a0 How refreshing to see a church of Christ web site that is more interested in promoting Bible truths than social activities!\u00a0 I just wanted to say that I\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Answer&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Answer","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/answer\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":21424,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/i-used-your-information-on-hymns-thanks\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":2},"title":"I used your information on hymns. Thanks!","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"April 10, 2020","format":false,"excerpt":"Question: Hello, I was writing an invitation for a Wednesday night service. I was looking up a hymnist and wanted to see if he might be a member of the church.\u00a0I still don't know, but I found your writings on lyricists and hymnists in the Lord's church.\u00a0I will no doubt\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Answer&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Answer","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/answer\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":20760,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/if-the-whole-church-makes-decisions-how-is-it-organized\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":3},"title":"If the whole church makes decisions, how is it organized?","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"November 7, 2009","format":false,"excerpt":"Question: I read\u00a0the reply by Ney Rieber, to the question posed by one that was having a problem reconciling with a congregation that does not have elders. These questions come to mind and I hope you can help answer them when you have time or maybe point me toward a\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Answer&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Answer","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/answer\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":35810,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/i-love-that-you-have-a-repository-for-answers-to-many-thorny-questions\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":4},"title":"I love that you have a repository for answers to many thorny questions","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"November 13, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"Question: Greetings! I have written before expressing my appreciation for your web site. I especially expressed how appreciative I am of the\u00a0question and answer or Ask section. I love that the Lord's church offers a repository for many thorny and often taboo subjects you have tackled. It is, I believe,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Answer&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Answer","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/answer\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":2633,"url":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/are-you-anti-or-liberal\/","url_meta":{"origin":16159,"position":5},"title":"Are you &#8220;anti&#8221; or &#8220;liberal&#8221;?","author":"Jeffrey Hamilton","date":"March 11, 2005","format":false,"excerpt":"Question: Wow! I am so happy to see a site that holds to sound doctrine.\u00a0 There is only one thing that I don't see much written on Institutionalism.\u00a0 I do see the article on church spending which is correct.\u00a0 I was wondering though if you all were \"anti\" or \"liberal\"\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Answer&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Answer","link":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/category\/answer\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/16159","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=16159"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/16159\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=16159"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=16159"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.lavistachurchofchrist.org\/cms\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=16159"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}